Regarding Super Eurobeat 250

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Re: Regarding Super Eurobeat 250

Post by Crockett » Dec 14th, '17, 16:54

xiao wrote:
Dec 14th, '17, 04:02
" As long as there's a single person buying a copy of Super Eurobeat .. we will continue making it. "

ー Max Matsuura
As long as common sense allows.

Switching on the pressing machine to manufacture CDs they are already sure that won't be sold out has just finished.

Sentiment never won with business. Max is miles further than in 90's and his decisions for such huge company like Avex Trax can't be against overall business rules.

He takes care about domestic market and imported music as the leader, and Eurobeat has been just eliminated from the game.

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Re: Regarding Super Eurobeat 250

Post by Bonkers » Dec 15th, '17, 02:24

I thought SS was working on a new BON track? He posted the other day he had finished a vocal session.

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Re: Regarding Super Eurobeat 250

Post by xiao » Dec 15th, '17, 05:26

Crockett wrote:
Dec 14th, '17, 16:54
Max is miles further than in 90's and his decisions for such huge company like Avex Trax can't be against overall business rules.
yep yep ~ I concur .. also of note this year Avex brought in Richard Blackstone (Google his background) to split the management of Avex Group Holdings. Alongside founder Max he is co-director of Avex as of April 2017.

They could always publish Eurobeat over the internet .. but I gather it's just not profitable anymore to give the Italian studios money for new songs.

--- --- ---

I did some research last year on what it costs to typically make a song of any genre from scratch. Mind you it doesn't take anything but time .. but for the sake of business, let's just say a typical professional studio/producer/team charges around $1,000 USD and higher for a 3 to 5 minute song. That does not include rights, ie. the rights are still the studio's.

If you're a musician, you can charge for your music from zero to a billion dollars & beyond. Let's take the theoretical example that you want SinclaireStyle to make a 13 track Hyper Techno LP and release it over Bandcamp.com | I think it's fair to first meet-up in person with Bratt & talk business, secondly to give him all the time he wants w/ no deadline for when the project is due, lastly start the price @ $1,000 USD for a track, but if he needs more money then you need to comply or no album. 13 songs at a minimum of $1,000 USD a song - that's approx. $13,000 USD for executive producing this theoretical Hyper Techno LP, released over Bandcamp, w/ all the rights to the songs kept by SinclaireStyle. You get your music and everyone's happy!

That's about the most kickstarter way of getting a professional team to make an album w/o actually using Kickstarter Patreon Gofundme etc etc ..

Sounds too complicated?Well if you're a professional studio, with very real expenses like artists & equipment & electricity, you can make music for free .. or negotiate with a company like Avex. Avex isn't evil .. as a company they're just shrewd.

--- --- ---

But like I mentioned .. keep your hopes up!This isn't the death of Italian Eurobeat .. rather the birth of something new ~ Image

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Re: Regarding Super Eurobeat 250

Post by Anthony McBazooka » Dec 15th, '17, 06:13

xiao wrote:
Dec 15th, '17, 05:26
Crockett wrote:
Dec 14th, '17, 16:54
Max is miles further than in 90's and his decisions for such huge company like Avex Trax can't be against overall business rules.
yep yep ~ I concur .. also of note this year Avex brought in Richard Blackstone (Google his background) to split the management of Avex Group Holdings. Alongside founder Max he is co-director of Avex as of April 2017.

They could always publish Eurobeat over the internet .. but I gather it's just not profitable anymore to give the Italian studios money for new songs.

--- --- ---

I did some research last year on what it costs to typically make a song of any genre from scratch. Mind you it doesn't take anything but time .. but for the sake of business, let's just say a typical professional studio/producer/team charges around $1,000 USD and higher for a 3 to 5 minute song. That does not include rights, ie. the rights are still the studio's.

If you're a musician, you can charge for your music from zero to a billion dollars & beyond. Let's take the theoretical example that you want SinclaireStyle to make a 13 track Hyper Techno LP and release it over Bandcamp.com | I think it's fair to first meet-up in person with Bratt & talk business, secondly to give him all the time he wants w/ no deadline for when the project is due, lastly start the price @ $1,000 USD for a track, but if he needs more money then you need to comply or no album. 13 songs at a minimum of $1,000 USD a song - that's approx. $13,000 USD for executive producing this theoretical Hyper Techno LP, released over Bandcamp, w/ all the rights to the songs kept by SinclaireStyle. You get your music and everyone's happy!

That's about the most kickstarter way of getting a professional team to make an album w/o actually using Kickstarter Patreon Gofundme etc etc ..

Sounds too complicated?Well if you're a professional studio, with very real expenses like artists & equipment & electricity, you can make music for free .. or negotiate with a company like Avex. Avex isn't evil .. as a company they're just shrewd.

--- --- ---

But like I mentioned .. keep your hopes up!This isn't the death of Italian Eurobeat .. rather the birth of something new ~ Image
It's difficult to calculate an exact amount because so many things have to be considered, but you're absolutely right that producing music on a high level costs money, be it just a wage for the artists (where you have the time thing already covered) or even use of equipment, rooms, etc. depending on the music you make.
That's why I don't get it when people say “music is just a hobby, not a profession” or “music should be free” (everything should be free but we live in capitalism and artists, too, need to survive in it), because if music would be just a hobby for everyone that's exactly also the quality we would get. Certain genres couldn't even exist like classical music for example.

I found something about that Blackstone guy
Despite the industry's struggles, Blackstone thinks the art form is thriving. More music is being recorded than ever before, "because you don't need a thousand dollars a day now to record in a studio." In fact, he said, "the enjoyment of music now is greater than ever. So what we have to figure out now is, is there a way to monetize that?"
Well, this is the problem, there is no appreciation for good quality music. If you just monetise the quantity that is being produced (which is already happening), music becomes interchangeable, boring, trivial, irrelevant. And artists don't earn enough to live from making music but there is a reseller industry that makes billions of $ from music. So if this guy thinks like that, of course there is no appreciation for Eurobeat and to him the SEB series is just a waste of money.
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Re: Regarding Super Eurobeat 250

Post by Lebon14 » Dec 15th, '17, 06:30

Rizzi let me on some of his info and if you think he makes 1k$USD a song, you're very far from the truth. I won't say the exact amount but let me just say that it's pretty far from that number.
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Re: Regarding Super Eurobeat 250

Post by xiao » Dec 15th, '17, 06:38

Lebon14 wrote:
Dec 15th, '17, 06:30
Rizzi let me on some of his info and if you think he makes 1k$USD a song, you're very far from the truth. I won't say the exact amount but let me just say that it's pretty far from that number.
Exactly.

For a big company like Avex, UMG, Victor, Columbia, Warner, Sony, Loen, etc etc .. even a single dollar spent on something that doesn't turn a profit, is a waste.

That's business .. and I hate it as much as you do my friend.

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Re: Regarding Super Eurobeat 250

Post by M2-EB » Dec 15th, '17, 12:52

Thank you for shedding light upon monetary values here. It's good that more music is being produced today than it was ever before, I like to say that arts in general are being mass produced by "hobbyists" and "professionals" (the line between these two being really blurred). When you put money into it, quality changes. For many artists this is the main issue. There are several platforms that help all kinds of artists (for example Patreon, where people can support with different amounts monthly or Kickstarter, for big projects that need a lot of money) but even then, they're not completely reliable (Patreon recently announced some changes in their fee system and people literally stopped supporting artists because it'd get much more expensive, they backed off after this and will "implement changes in a way that's better for everyone").

I really want to believe this is not the death of italian eurobeat but........ if they were there for the money there's nothing we can do that'll be enough. And not fair too: we're not talking about one or two artists here, there are over 5 different labels/studios with several artists, musicians, producers, composers..... I give my props to Avex for keeping everyone together all this time. I don't know what I'd do honestly. This is all too complicated…
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Re: Regarding Super Eurobeat 250

Post by KiraTM » Dec 15th, '17, 13:03

I see you talking aboutconversations with Eurobeat producers here and there. I've got some questions I'd really like to ask. Are there other ways to contact them besides facebook? Otherwise I need to look for my old fake account I've got there.

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Re: Regarding Super Eurobeat 250

Post by xiao » Dec 15th, '17, 13:10

M2-EB wrote:
Dec 15th, '17, 12:52
.. if they were there for the money there's nothing we can do that'll be enough.
Those are my sentiments regarding SCP and Hyper Techno. I never understood why Mr. Fang & Vicious Angel never got a Bandcamp release .. aside from being told that Avex owns all the rights. :(
KiraTM wrote:
Dec 15th, '17, 13:03
I see you talking aboutconversations with Eurobeat producers here and there. I've got some questions I'd really like to ask. Are there other ways to contact them besides facebook? Otherwise I need to look for my old fake account I've got there.
Facebook & Twitter are the easiest ways. But if you wanna talk business .. e-mail - a phone call/text - or an appointment in person is the appropriate thing to do imo.

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Re: Regarding Super Eurobeat 250

Post by Lebon14 » Dec 15th, '17, 17:45

M2-EB wrote:
Dec 15th, '17, 12:52
(Patreon recently announced some changes in their fee system and people literally stopped supporting artists because it'd get much more expensive, they backed off after this and will "implement changes in a way that's better for everyone").
Fyi: Thay made a 180 on this: https://blog.patreon.com/not-rolling-out-fees-change/
xiao wrote:
Dec 15th, '17, 13:10
M2-EB wrote:
Dec 15th, '17, 12:52
.. if they were there for the money there's nothing we can do that'll be enough.
aside from being told that Avex owns all the rights. :(
Because that's the reason.
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Re: Regarding Super Eurobeat 250

Post by M2-EB » Dec 15th, '17, 18:01

Lebon14 wrote:
Dec 15th, '17, 17:45
...
What I said still stands though hahaha. They saw the backlash this announcement caused and decided to not do it. I'm pretty sure they'll come up with something different that'll be bad for the artists. The ideal would be artists dealing with their clients directly. The sad truth is that they have to rely on a 3rd person (or company, in this case) to be seen, to sell their works, to do pretty much anything :( just take a look at these online shops' fees… it's absurd. That's another reason why I think, if they're in this only for the money, our efforts won't be enough. The fanbase is too small.
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Re: Regarding Super Eurobeat 250

Post by Anthony McBazooka » Dec 15th, '17, 18:25

M2-EB wrote:
Dec 15th, '17, 18:01
Lebon14 wrote:
Dec 15th, '17, 17:45
...
What I said still stands though hahaha. They saw the backlash this announcement caused and decided to not do it. I'm pretty sure they'll come up with something different that'll be bad for the artists. The ideal would be artists dealing with their clients directly. The sad truth is that they have to rely on a 3rd person (or company, in this case) to be seen, to sell their works, to do pretty much anything :( just take a look at these online shops' fees… it's absurd. That's another reason why I think, if they're in this only for the money, our efforts won't be enough. The fanbase is too small.
It never has been different in the sense that companies made more profit from music than the artists. The ways of distribution have changed and also artists now need to build their careers all by themselves without financial help from labels, so making arts is for the privileged only (or you really need to be ready to suffer a lot).
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Re: Regarding Super Eurobeat 250

Post by drnrg » Dec 15th, '17, 20:10

So we have six albums to go, before the greatest Italian Hi Energy music series ends. THis is some seriously sad news indeed. If we have five albums left that would be 75 new songs to still look forward to tho. That's because I'm guessing 250 will be a nonstop extravaganza. That is still a lot of great music. I hope it does stretch too August, because each new album's effect lasts on me for a very long time. I'm still deeply into songs from 234.

I do hope we can someday see a lot of the unreleased material that has escaped us through the years. Maybe AVEX can start a retro Eurobeat series , especially for those long awaited tracks.

I too hope the italian labels will continue to release their creations on juno and other online venues. They kind of always have. It's just that AVEX chose certain songs for the series. If another series or company decides to take the wheel, than I will still be there supporting the genre for as long as it continues.

We still need to find out about Dave Rodgers new company. I'm sure he will still be making music. HRG and Saifam have always continued the streak. Releasing their songs independently. SO all we can do is hope for the best and hope the labels still know that Eurobeat is like oxygen to all of us. We need it to live.

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Re: Regarding Super Eurobeat 250

Post by Lebon14 » Dec 15th, '17, 21:14

drnrg wrote:
Dec 15th, '17, 20:10
So we have six albums to go, before the greatest Italian Hi Energy music series ends. THis is some seriously sad news indeed. If we have five albums left that would be 75 new songs to still look forward to tho. That's because I'm guessing 250 will be a nonstop extravaganza. That is still a lot of great music. I hope it does stretch too August, because each new album's effect lasts on me for a very long time. I'm still deeply into songs from 234.
Corrections: 4 volumes left. And 247-249 don't have any new songs and so is 250 per tradition.
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Re: Regarding Super Eurobeat 250

Post by Crockett » Dec 15th, '17, 21:36

I hope the artists will be enough well informed why SEB must've been ceased.

---> If there is an Eurobeat fan base bigger than was the real sale, it means that people didn't buy the music they don't like.

----> Producers must be aware of it and change the style.

The revival of older music noticeable around the world isn't just back to the old sound, but this is a mix of modern and old possibilities.

Eurobeat itself but I felt even some artists prided themselves the level of technical advancement they reached in Eurobeat discography.

It was certain that sooner or later it will come out they are lost far from the core of music designated to dance.

I believe they will do an overview, make a comparison and now free of Avex Trax "pledge", they will be finally able to develop their creativity again and follow the course as other musicians do.

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