Why I think "Eurobeat Wouldn't be Popular in America" is silly.

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M2-EB
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Re: Why I think "Eurobeat Wouldn't be Popular in America" is silly.

Post by M2-EB » Sep 8th, '17, 14:24

#Infinity wrote:
Sep 8th, '17, 05:18
I don't know, I really don't want more songs to contract Moon Man syndrome. It's blasphemous that a genre of music so precious to my nostalgia is now being associated with alt-right trolls more than anything else.
Stop and think for awhile: should people stop liking certain things because nazis and the likes took said things to themselves and claimed as their own?

No.

Music is art and art is used, in many occasions, to protest and fight for good, for peace, for love… It makes zero sense to me that they THINK they have anything to do with eurobeat when the whole community seems against their views (and so do the artists). I wish Avex would take a step forward and don't condone such things - they'll take entire channels down because uploading their content but not WW shocking footage used for ""meme"" purposes >_>
Kat wrote:
Sep 8th, '17, 10:36
Eurobeat? I'd rather say that Eurodance would be popular again in Europe
Aqua , 2 Unlimited , La Bouche , Mr.President , Groove Coverage
Wholehearted agree <3 these are pretty timeless and always good no matter the year
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Re: Why I think "Eurobeat Wouldn't be Popular in America" is silly.

Post by Markos » Sep 8th, '17, 16:28

M2-EB wrote:
Sep 8th, '17, 14:24
Stop and think for awhile: should people stop liking certain things because nazis and the likes took said things to themselves and claimed as their own?

No.

Well good luck walking down the street with a swastica on your jacket and see how many people care that they stole that symbol from elsewhere.

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Re: Why I think "Eurobeat Wouldn't be Popular in America" is silly.

Post by alpines » Sep 8th, '17, 16:37

Markos wrote:
Sep 8th, '17, 16:28
Well good luck walking down the street with a swastica on your jacket and see how many people care that they stole that symbol from elsewhere.
Do you really expect people to react and think rationally?

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Re: Why I think "Eurobeat Wouldn't be Popular in America" is silly.

Post by M2-EB » Sep 8th, '17, 17:16

Markos wrote:
Sep 8th, '17, 16:28
Well good luck walking down the street with a swastica on your jacket and see how many people care that they stole that symbol from elsewhere.
That symbol is STILL used today in many religions around Asia like Buddhism, Hinduism, etc, it had a meaning before all that sh*t.
I really enjoy eurobeat. I might stop trying to show it to new people in case worst happens, but stop liking it? Because hateful, bigoted people? Not gonna happen.

I think it's not really my place to say things I know little about though. I don't see eurobeat being used to promote these things, unlike symbols that could be distorted and transformed into other things. But who knows? It's a really difficult topic :/
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Re: Why I think "Eurobeat Wouldn't be Popular in America" is silly.

Post by Markos » Sep 8th, '17, 17:40

alpines wrote:
Sep 8th, '17, 16:37
Markos wrote:
Sep 8th, '17, 16:28
Well good luck walking down the street with a swastica on your jacket and see how many people care that they stole that symbol from elsewhere.
Do you really expect people to react and think rationally?
Ha, of course not was just pointing out that was a bad example to use...



Honestly I have zero interest in internet memes or w/e they are and wasn't even aware people were making such negative things.. as a fan of EB I wasn't aware so if someone who doesn't even know what EB is, would they really connect the two things together or care that much? Probably they would just ignore it and forget seconds later.

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Re: Why I think "Eurobeat Wouldn't be Popular in America" is silly.

Post by Crockett » Sep 8th, '17, 18:53

Markos wrote:
Sep 8th, '17, 17:40
Honestly I have zero interest in internet memes or w/e they are and wasn't even aware people were making such negative things..
I even don't know what nazi connection with Eurobeat disturb so many people and what it has to do with popularity in America ? Where you guys live ? Do we talk about the same Eurobeat ?

An episode with Manuel is nazi symbol of Eurobeat ? Is he some representative of the entire genre ? Who exactly seen these memes that it became some problem ? Somebody reported a site, user, meme to FB staff ?

Again, only japanene have no shitty problems, because what serious fan cares there, anywhere, about such low quality entertainment created in Europe or America regarding Eurobeat ? This is promotion by lovers ? Funny as hell...

More and more growlers seem grow out of the ground, fans isolate themselves, try to snatch a piece of Eurobeat from its reality and put to new alternative reality, however as I can see their own memes are a barrier to gain more popularity, or a reason of ridiculing Eurobeat. Clean your mind and start being interested in music, artists and so on.

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Re: Why I think "Eurobeat Wouldn't be Popular in America" is silly.

Post by Lebon14 » Sep 8th, '17, 20:58

M2-EB wrote:
Sep 8th, '17, 17:16
Markos wrote:
Sep 8th, '17, 16:28
Well good luck walking down the street with a swastica on your jacket and see how many people care that they stole that symbol from elsewhere.
That symbol is STILL used today in many religions around Asia like Buddhism, Hinduism, etc, it had a meaning before all that sh*t.
I really enjoy eurobeat. I might stop trying to show it to new people in case worst happens, but stop liking it? Because hateful, bigoted people? Not gonna happen.
(off-topic)
Notes:
Swastika has two variations. The right facing one, which is the symbol of the nazis and, the left facing one, symbol of peace in buddhism (well, generally) and is also called a manji.

So today, even if you would show a manji on your clothes, because of people's lack of education, you would be labeled as a nazi. Sucks hardcore because it's not what it means...
(/off-topic)
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Re: Why I think "Eurobeat Wouldn't be Popular in America" is silly.

Post by Wataru Akiyama » Sep 8th, '17, 21:35

Crockett wrote:
Sep 8th, '17, 18:53
Markos wrote:
Sep 8th, '17, 17:40
Honestly I have zero interest in internet memes or w/e they are and wasn't even aware people were making such negative things..
I even don't know what nazi connection with Eurobeat disturb so many people and what it has to do with popularity in America ? Where you guys live ? Do we talk about the same Eurobeat ?

Yo - go to Youtube, type in "Manuel Gas Gas Gas Hitler" if you want to find out where all this came from.
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Re: Why I think "Eurobeat Wouldn't be Popular in America" is silly.

Post by Crockett » Sep 8th, '17, 22:27

Wataru Akiyama wrote:
Sep 8th, '17, 21:35
Yo - go to Youtube, type in "Manuel Gas Gas Gas Hitler" if you want to find out where all this came from.
:)
Crockett wrote:
Sep 8th, '17, 18:53
An episode with Manuel is nazi symbol of Eurobeat ? Is he some representative of the entire genre ? Who exactly seen these memes that it became some problem ?
What impact has it on market in Japan, on any fans who buy CDs, on the genre renown, history ? That's a single case to solve, report, ban etc.

Daily politicians, famous persons are offended in the internet, behind their back, hating is fun in the virtual world, pictures are converting, using in wrong, negative meaning. This is not trend out of control in Eurobeat. Calm down.

Is awarness of the II world war big in America ? I have doubts whether nazi swastika is scary there, regardless of other meanings. In Germany or here in Poland it will be obvious association.

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Re: Why I think "Eurobeat Wouldn't be Popular in America" is silly.

Post by #Infinity » Sep 8th, '17, 23:27

Crockett wrote:
Sep 8th, '17, 18:53
An episode with Manuel is nazi symbol of Eurobeat ? Is he some representative of the entire genre ? Who exactly seen these memes that it became some problem ?

What impact has it on market in Japan, on any fans who buy CDs, on the genre renown, history ? That's a single case to solve, report, ban etc.

Daily politicians, famous persons are offended in the internet, behind their back, hating is fun in the virtual world, pictures are converting, using in wrong, negative meaning. This is not trend out of control in Eurobeat. Calm down.
It really is out of eurobeat's control. Manuel himself doesn't at all condone his music's association with Auschwitz, but still hundreds of thousands of ignorant people consume it as just that. "Gas Gas Gas" wasn't even well known at all prior to its viral explosion because it was a eurobeat song that came out during a time the genre was already significantly declining in popularity, but now it basically has the inescapable reputation as the Hitler techno song.

In the same way, McDonald's tried fiercely to combat the Moon Man meme after it showed up in 2007, taking down YouTube videos left and right, but ultimately, the craze was so out of control that the company was forced to completely disown Mac Tonight, and after several years, Moon Man videos are still being released but are no longer being responsibly taken down, to the point where we have articles like this. Douchebag masses have essentially transformed a swinging McDonald's mascot from the 80s into a symbol of bigotry and violence, just as the Nazi party turned the swastika shape into one of the most offensive and inappropriate images of all time.
Is awarness of the II world war big in America ? I have doubts whether nazi swastika is scary there, regardless of other meanings. In Germany or here in Poland it will be obvious association.
What infuriates me about the Nazi memes contaminating eurobeat is that I can no longer openly appreciate songs I used to love like "Gas Gas Gas" or "Beat of the Rising Sun" because now most people will think that I'm some insensitive racist for playing them. It doesn't matter how you personally view the respective tracks, nor what they originally represented, it's their current defamation that makes it politically insensitive just to embrace them like you could before, because harmful misunderstandings are just far too likely. In a society controlled by public perception, none of this can be taken lightly.
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Re: Why I think "Eurobeat Wouldn't be Popular in America" is silly.

Post by M2-EB » Sep 8th, '17, 23:53

#Infinity wrote:
Sep 8th, '17, 23:27
Trying to combat things using methods that long before were used to exhaustion and didn't work isn't the way to fight. People simply don't seem to learn… Besides, trying to delete, exclude and/or censor these kinds of people just aggravates things. In an ideal world, the best way to deal with all these problems is through education. The effective way, though, might be making people pay (with money, freedom or their own lives even).

About your second paragraph… that's just too bad. People will be offended no matter what. Am I a bad person for still enjoying some songs even if they are now associated with bigots? Should I just back off and "oh, you're right, these songs are really insensitive…". Following the same logic, soon that might happen to the whole genre, what will we do then? Either way, I'm preeeeeeetty sure Big A won't give a damn lol
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Re: Why I think "Eurobeat Wouldn't be Popular in America" is silly.

Post by #Infinity » Sep 9th, '17, 04:22

M2-EB wrote:
Sep 8th, '17, 23:53
Trying to combat things using methods that long before were used to exhaustion and didn't work isn't the way to fight. People simply don't seem to learn… Besides, trying to delete, exclude and/or censor these kinds of people just aggravates things. In an ideal world, the best way to deal with all these problems is through education. The effective way, though, might be making people pay (with money, freedom or their own lives even).
Oh, how I wish it was that easy. Once the Internet gets a hold of it, a few noble souls are simply not enough to reverse the torrent of trolls fueling "Gas Gas Gas" and Mac Tonight's newfound infamy.
About your second paragraph… that's just too bad. People will be offended no matter what. Am I a bad person for still enjoying some songs even if they are now associated with bigots? Should I just back off and "oh, you're right, these songs are really insensitive…". Following the same logic, soon that might happen to the whole genre, what will we do then? Either way, I'm preeeeeeetty sure Big A won't give a damn lol
It's completely ridiculous, yes, but there's just so little that can be done because nowadays, eurobeat isn't a relevant enough part of Japanese or western cult culture to outgrow the negative connotations it now suffers.

I should probably point out that 15½ years ago, the We Drink Ritalin meme video, set to John Desire's "Hot Limit," did prominently feature Hitler throughout, although there was no focus on Auschwitz like "Gas Gas Gas." However, in 2002, eurobeat was still a tour de force in Japan, showing up in the Initial D anime, Dance Dance Revolution, and having the Super Eurobeat and Euromach series continuing to sell quite well. Not to mention, people in the west were generally a lot more interested in Japanese than they are today, so much more of this type of media garnered a cult following. The point is, eurobeat was far more than just Hitler techno because it enjoyed far more exposure to a wider range of people, so one video featuring Hitler was nowhere near enough to turn it into an icon of hate.

Even Mac Tonight never turned into the racist Moon Man until several years after McDonald's stopped featuring him in their commercials (but still hadn't disowned the character), so to the younger generation, he came to meant something far more disturbing than to those he originally targeted.
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Re: Why I think "Eurobeat Wouldn't be Popular in America" is silly.

Post by Crockett » Sep 9th, '17, 14:56

Mr. Contini and his Bulldozer band, which came close to Eurobeat and A.Beat-C. in the middle of 90's also may arouse ambiguous associations, actually inverted cross, symbol of devil printed on one of their covers is unequivocal. Metal music influenced "satanist art" surely isn't positive and will reject many people from such subculture and genre.

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Re: Why I think "Eurobeat Wouldn't be Popular in America" is silly.

Post by xiao » Sep 9th, '17, 15:08

#Infinity wrote:
Sep 9th, '17, 04:22
Oh, how I wish it was that easy ..
It's definitely not easy. But I think while music can be used for hate .. it can more than often be a vessel of love 💗

More than politics, more than religion, more than words on a forum, more than voices on a podcast, more than posts on social, more than the news, more than school & education, more than any other media ..

Music has the power to change peoples hearts, to turn their ignorance, hate, and discrimination into mercy, forgiveness, and kindness. Manuel's song was abused and taken out of context by edgy/vulgar kids on the internet that knew no better. But all music, including Eurobeat, lives on ~ and we'll make better songs and we'll meet ignorance with light. That's the beauty of Eurobeat & that's the beauty of music. It can bring someone to tears, make someone reflect, and it can change someone's life. Because music is matter intangible, beauty subtle unseen, faith of the highest gleam ..

Michael Jackson said:If you wanna make the world a better place, take a look at yourself & make a change. And it was in the poem of a song he wrote it .. and it changed my life. So I have faith those kids making counterfeit art and trashy memes, will one day find how beautiful the music they took and distorted really is. And they'll leave internet culture, cause it was only a corruption of a bigger beauty they hadn't yet seen. ♩
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Re: Why I think "Eurobeat Wouldn't be Popular in America" is silly.

Post by M2-EB » Sep 9th, '17, 15:30

xiao wrote:
Sep 9th, '17, 15:08
THANK YOU :D

Seriously though, even if eurobeat don't go popular again ever, its community will be there trying to support the genre as much as they can and I think this is super important! I've seen that in many other niche music genres and arts… small fanbases are the ones that stick around until the end usually.
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